The Bucs, by any measure, had a great chance to move to 5-2 against a mediocre Lions team. But a combination of miscues, inexperience and rare glimpses of Detroit competence resulted in a 23-16 loss and a 4-3 record heading into a tough matchup with Jacksonville.

The loss begs the question: are the Bucs really read to move into playoff contention - and stay?

It appears perhaps you misunderstood the matchup this afternoon.

In fact, the LIONS had a great chance to move to 4-2 against a very mediocre Bucs team.  A combination of Lions playing a consistent pass prevent defense style along with the TB fortune of recovering an onside kick resulted in the Bucs in the final two minutes presenting the illusion that they might have a chance today.  This, rather than being seen for what they actually are - a mediocre team who struggles to score 14 points in a game week in, week out.

With regard to your closing inquiry, we’ll reefer you to this thread from last week which pretty much sums up the state of TBay Bucs football chances in 2007

http://www.tboforums.com/index.php/forums/viewthread/3043/

This week the Jags starting QB Garrard will definitely be out. That back-up that Jacksonville has didn’t impress too many people in his relief role last night. Maybe our Defense can set the O up this week for a slight upset.

BUCSTER, I can’t disagree.

Many NFL success stories over the years have quite a bit to do with being in the right place at right time.

Bucs enjoyed the advantage of playing at Carolina earlier this year first week that Delhomme was Out and now they get Jacksonville with a QB that appears to be several notches below David Carr.

Jags will have a lot of work this week to put together a game plan that can succeed.

It’s been quite some time since I saw an Opening line move 7 pts, but this one did upon news of the Jags QB situation.

The Jags were confronted with a 14 pt deficit when they lost Garrard.  When they come into Tampa, the score will be 0-0 and I kinda think they can control the line of scrimmage sufficiently to get this one.

It’s not as if the Bucs have much of a downfield passing game either.

Should be quite the dink and dunk contest

Hey, Murkywatersteve, if the Bucs are a “very mediocre” team, then how do you rate the rest of the NFC South?  For my money, literally, unless Jeff G. gets injured, the Bucs are a shoo-in to win it by going at least 6-3 the rest of the way.  I don’t see anybody else closing at 10-6.

If the TBay Bucs win ten games, I’ll state now that I’ll be rather astonished.  They’ll also utterly smash the preseason Vegas betting line of 7 total Wins (u -130)

Currently they look like a reasonable chance at Home vs Atlanta

Other than that, I’m at a loss to find potential wins for them.

It’s reasonable to predict that come season’s end, the NFC South will have less Wins among their four teams than any other division in the NFL.

So this does present a longshot opportunity for TB Bucs to get over and capture the flag.

However, then they will be drummed out of first round of NFC playoffs by any number of teams.  And thanks to their mediocre nine win “division championship”, they won’t get to draft until about 15th in 2008, which further exacerbates their future dilemma.

If we’re going to rank the NFC Teams, it’s likely the Bucs could rate no better than ninth.

Only SF, ATL, STL appear to be destined to finish lower than the Bucs.

On a neutral field right now, the Bucs would be clear Vegas underdogs versus every team in the NFC save for the three I listed above.

Murkywatersteve , remembering my assumption that Jeff G. does not get injured, here are the 6 wins: Arizona, Atlanta(2), Washington, Houston & S.F.  If they slip up against any of these as they did against Detroit, they can easily make up for it against N.O. or Carolina - - both of whom they have already taken down.  Admittedly, they do not have the most difficult schedule around, but that’s part of my reasoning in claiming a 10 win season for them.  Hopefully by the time post season rolls around, Monte will have organized a pass rush & who knows what might happen then.  The next game against Jax is the toughest left on the schedule.  I am assuming a loss, but I fully believe the Bucs are capable of beating them & maybe fairly easily - - 10 points or better.  Where are you then?  Will we still be able to count on hearing from you?

"Hopefully by the time post season rolls around, Monte will have organized a pass rush..”

SH: Hiring hit men to cripple the offensive linemen of upcoming opponents would put Coach Kiffin in prison.

So I’m kinda thinking that the current Buc average of a big two sacks per game is about the best you’ll see the rest of the way.

Cybuc, it will be far more interesting to see if you’re still posting here come late December.  I welcome you to consider that notion as all of us football fans can benefit from increased sharing of ideas.

With Jax losing their QB we should note that everyone in the NFC South has now lost their starting QB (counting Vick from ATL) as well as Jax from the AFC.  Other divisions are not fairing very well either - just ask fans in Arizona, St. Louis, San Francisco, Tennessee, Miami, etc.  Running backs are not fairing much better.

So the question is, are today’s players just to big and heavy which is making football a more dangerous sport than it already is?  I think the answer is yes, and these stories of players still taking “supplements” is not helping.  Is there anything the NFL can do about this?  I just ask the question, I don’t have an answer for the problem.

Because of the numerous crippled teams, I think despite the Bucs problems this year that if the injuries let up and they don’t lose any more players (an unlikely prospect at best - one I would NOT bet on), the NFC South is weaker than it has ever been.  People forget, but this “pathetic” division I hear so much about is the one that has a team in the NFC Championship game every year since the division realignment occured and this division was formed.

I don’t think anyone from the South will be in the NFC Championship game this year for the first time.  Having said that, I agree with Steve in thinking that whoever wins the NFC South will probably be picked off in the first round. Where I respectively disagree is on who will win the South.  On that, I am not sure and I think who is the last one standing (who is least injured).  Right now, because they have the only starting QB standing, the Bucs are in good (if you can call it that) position.  However, as Steve also points out, it hurts the Bucs from another high draft pick.

The Bucs are a team in transition, like it or not.  It is a mix of young (finally) and old players that are still performing (just ask the “dinosaurs.’) The Bucs are living on borrowed time.  They still a need a couple of good drafts to refill the talent level.  Needs coming in the next few years are:

QB - If Simms does not do it, Garcia is not lasting much longer
RB - Cadillac is broken down, like college, and they need a permanent solution
WR - Ike Hillard and Joey Galloway at over 10 years each are not getting younger
Derrick Brooks and Ronde Barber - am I the only one, but has anyone else noticed the increased number of penalites/mistakes this year from these two?  They are ticking time bombs at this point.
Defensive line - another lineman to shore up a unit which is peforming acceptably right now.

On the good side, many of the late round draft picks and younger free agent pickups are peforming well and are a reason why the Bucs are much more competitive this year besides the performance of Jeff Garcia.

In the end, the NFC South is tossup and realistically, the Bucs are in the running as is Carolina.  Not sure if New Orleans can come back from its huge deficit or not - and Atlanta is just a mess with no QB, no running game, and not much defense (yes, picking up a new coach from Mora was SUCH a good move - congratulations Arthur Blank on making the NFC South a little bit easier for the three other teams).  If I were betting on it, since Carolina still has to play Indianapolis, Tennessee, Green Bay, Dallas, and Seattle - I think the road is stacked against them because their schedule is twice as hard as Tampa’s.  I give a slight edge to Tampa since Carolina is going to have a very tough time winning any of those games - just like the Bucs would if they had to play them all.  New Orleans is a wait and see since more is needed to get them back into contention, although they have taken some steps towards that resolution.

I agree about Brooks and barber making mistakes. I cant tell you how many times I’ve yelled at them through the t.v. and my girlfriend says “ But arent they smartest players?” which drives me even more mad when I have to reply, “ EXACTLY!” However, they are both still coming up with big plays (Ronde’s two INT’s that were reversed, Brooks forced fumble on Steven Jackson). I don’t agree with all who continue to say we are an old team. Then there are those who say we are too young in core positions. I’ve noticed Acura always seems to keep a level head as he puts it best, ‘IN TRANSITION’. The haters ("Murkeywater" Steve,LOL who had been so silent during our previous wins) always likes to leave out the fact that these young guys are producing for us. Ruud, Tanard Jackson, and Jovan Haye are playing great. Not average, not above average, GREAT. The offensive line ((clears throat)) YOUNG offensive line, has done enough to protect our Savior. The middle of the road guys, like Jermaine Phillips and Buchanon, have performed well (although, Ill admit Jermaine’s trying a LITTLE, too hard to knock heads off and isn’t wrapping up well) and lastly, the Dinosaurs, Garcia, Hilliard, Brooks, Barber, and of course Galloway are all still pulling their weight. Injuries guys, injuries. You can complain to Gruden for a lack of ‘depth’. But who anticipates losing top two running backs, two receivers, my favorite tight end (alex smith was one of our TD targets) Bk goes down early in the season, Petigout gets hurt...you know? For whoever said we should never have expected to win that Lions game, you’re an idiot. We handed it to them, but that’s what happens. Granted GREAT teams don’t do that. But Playoff caliber teams are capable of it. All in all, I’m still obviously extremely optimistic about our team and see 10 wins in our sights. Vinny ain’t gonna back up that performance, whoever the hell the third stringer in Atlanta is, he’s not gonna get the job done, and when it comes time to grit your teeth and bear down, we are going to pull off wins against the suddenly rejuvinated N.O. We’re there. If you’re not on the bandwagon now, YOU’RE NOT WELCOME LATER.

” If you’re not on the bandwagon now, YOU’RE NOT WELCOME LATER.”

SH: Heh...Nothing better than Myopic NFL Fan, regardless of city.

Murkywatersteve, we won’t have to wait until late December - - if the Bucs can’t take down Arizona at home, I’ll have to go on IR, as in Individual:Retarded.  I’ll be happy to keep posting while I eat my humble pie, tho.  And what will be on your plate if we whip up on Jax?

My plate will be at least $20 lighter if that happens on accounta I invested that much on Jags +3.5

Maybe we’ll both win if Bucs prevail straight up by three or less.

Thx for the good thread, sbrown2.  My answer to your playoff contention question would be considerably different than Murkywatersteve’s.  This year’s chances look to be superb, but that is in part due to a softer schedule than usual, plus the division as a whole is having an off year.
The future rests on Jeff G.’s ability to compete at approx. his current level.  Will that be another 2 years?  3 at the outside?  Dunno.  But the rest of the team looks to come back pretty solidly.
When injury replacements perform reasonably satisfactorily (i.e., Donald Penn, Earnest Graham, Jeremy Stevens) and then the starters recover, the team’s depth is aided immensely.  Look at the depth chart already.  All three OL reserves each have multiple NFL starts.  Our DL rotates nine guys.
Our back seven have several NFL starters playing reserve roles.  I think we’re getting ready to roll!